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Tuesday, February 19, 2008

Lakewood Whole Foods decision has many up in arms

By Pegasus News wire

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Lakewooders have been all atwitter about the news that Whole Foods plans to remodel the old Minyard's store, rather than tear it down and start fresh. Comments on The Advocate's Back Talk blog and Frontburner have been strongly expressing their disappointment in the decision and the residents' possible influence on it.

Posted by Alex B.

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Comments

Pavel Lishin

Pavel Lishin Verified

Not living in Lakewood, I have no idea why this is such a huge deal. Does somebody's uncle own a construction business or something?

4 months, 2 weeks ago ( Link to this comment | Suggest removal )

Mike Orren

Mike Orren Staff

Pavel, here's why it's a huge deal...

That intersection is the heart of Lakewood -- one of Dallas' more defined and recognizable neighborhoods. And it's got a lot of passionate advocates, many of whom are high-income and have time to worry about such things as traffic flow and pedestrian flow, etc.

Lakewood is also, in my opinion, the Eastern edge of "high-end" Dallas. There's a lot more Dallas East of there, but not, per capita or per square mile as many distinctive retailers, restaurants or grocers.

Take me for instance. Once the Tom Thumb in my neighborhood closed down because of low revenue / high shoplifting, it left me with the following choices for groceries:

  • .7 miles to the Sav-a-Lot, the store so cheap it can't afford an "e." Not acceptable.

  • 1.3 miles to a very skeevy Minyards on Ferguson. Have literally never gone there without being panhandled. And the produce sucks. AND no alcohol.

  • 1.9 miles to the Casa Linda Albertsons. This store is up and down, but again, meat and produce are iffy. And, no alcohol.

  • 2.5 miles into Mesquite for nothing better than any of the above.

  • 4.6 miles to the new Whole Foods site, which used to be a Minyards. Chief advantage over closer Minyards was that the area is not dry.

  • 5.6 miles to the current Whole Foods site. That one mile is a bigger difference than it sounds, because it goes through largely residential streets with lots of stop signs and lights. And the Whole Foods is overcrowded with people and product.

  • 7.9 miles to Central Market.

Everyone lake-side and East is in the same boat. If you're not happy with standard grocery store fare and want a bottle of wine with dinner, this new store makes a big difference in your grocery choices.

For us, it means a twice-weekly (at least) trip to CM. Something we'd happily drop if the new Whole Foods is all it can be. But the decision point is one of both convenience and quality.

So I want the biggest, nicest grocery store conceivable at Gaston and Abrams. Some of those who live closer don't want me clogging up their neighborhood or the store turning into a monstrosity that dominates all else. And note that those folks are only 3.5 miles away from CM-- In other words closer to it than I am to the new WF location. So they can easily get their groceries elsewhere.

4 months, 2 weeks ago ( Link to this comment | Suggest removal )

Rawlins Gilliland Verified

All good points and true. However, you are, just across I-30, very close to 1) Sams 2) a Wal-Mart megastore 3) even a very good well run clean Fiesta farther south Buckner (good produce, EXTREMELY fast in and out--always--- vs. the interminable unpredictability of trying to buy anything at that Casa Linda Albertson's...I gave up years ago.) All the above, no alcohol. But many people who are near full service great or greater grocers are not near a Sam's or Wal-Mart (or for that matter Fiesta which has a lot of pluses if you know how to shop/cook).

My eyebrow-raising is when the protest in Lakewood was not calling the spade the spade and you just diagramed. It had the look and feel of a smoke and mirrors protest wrapped in 'green' eco-speak, when in reality, it was all as you succinctly say.

4 months, 2 weeks ago ( Link to this comment | Suggest removal )

Mike Orren

Mike Orren Staff

I refuse to acknowledge the existence of Wal-Mart/Sams.

Truth be told, I forgot those because I find them absolutely unshoppable. And not just because of the lack of hooch. On the rare occasions I go to Wal-Mart, April can tell without me saying a word, just by my demeanor.

Realizing I sound like a terrific food snob here. I love the lowbrow -- I just want quality ingredients, an experience that doesn't suck, and a side of hooch. Is that too much to ask?

You're right about Fiesta too. When we used to live closer to it, I loved shopping there.

4 months, 2 weeks ago ( Link to this comment | Suggest removal )

Nathan Stull

Nathan Stull Verified

I will agree with everything Mike said above about the area's shopping. The Super Wal-Mart is just painful. It's so large, yet I've never seen more than 4 lanes open, which makes lines to check out long. Spend 10 minutes in line there and about a year will be shaved off the end of your life.

I will also add that I think another big let-down about this Whole Foods news is the area was promised a flagship store, much like the one on Lamar in Austin. If you haven't seen that one, then your hopes didn't go up. If you have seen it, then you probably had hopes of something in Lakewood that rivals any of the better grocery options in North Dallas and beyond the loops--a rival that also embraced the character and charm of the East Dallas neighborhood.

I wish HEB would move into Dallas more than just Central Markets. That is the best grocery store in Texas.

On a side note, I'm going to check out that Fiesta. I went to the one on Ross (near the Whole Foods on Greenville that Mike mentioned above in the sixth bullet) and heard employees say it was straining to keep up with the demands of supplying the new shoppers that migrated from the closed Lakewood Minyards.

Another downside to the closures in the Far East area is prescriptions. When that Minyards on Fergusson closed, suddenly our pharmacist was out of basic drugs like birth control because of the huge increase in customers.

4 months, 2 weeks ago ( Link to this comment | Suggest removal )

Mike Orren

Mike Orren Staff

"...our pharmacist was out of basic drugs like birth control because of the huge increase in customers"

Which means an East Dallas population explosion...which means more drain on the limited grocery stores in the area...which means impending famine and mass hysteria!

Smoke 'em if you got 'em...

4 months, 2 weeks ago ( Link to this comment | Suggest removal )

Rawlins Gilliland Verified

Here's how I do it: Fruits and veggies, Fiesta and Sam's. Meat, fiesta for chicken and Sams for steaks. (Sam's steaks have been excellent incl. tenderloins, ribeyes). Sam's dairy, produce in mass and many fruits, bags spinich, etc. Wal-Mart dry ingredients, cereals, etc. Petfoods. Etc.

The trick with ANY Wal-Mart is to go early in the day and avoid the tribal rituals that are sufficating. Same to a lesser exception, Sams. I think the whole reason to have an iPod is to wear when shopping this retail pair. But if you know how to shop, have a game plan,it works if timed well.

PS: Meanwhile, the Buckner Fiesta is probably not farther from you, Mike, than that CasaLinda Albertson's-from-hell. It is amazingly speedy and pleasant. Try it. It (the distance) may be psycological...being south of I-30.
Bone-Ape-Teet.

4 months, 2 weeks ago ( Link to this comment | Suggest removal )

Pavel Lishin

Pavel Lishin Verified

I didn't realize it was a matter of location. I thought the choice was to either renovate the Minyards building, or tear it down and build a new one in its place.

4 months, 2 weeks ago ( Link to this comment | Suggest removal )

Mike Orren

Mike Orren Staff

That's right Pavel. If your read my first long comment, the issue is that I and others like me want the teardown and there are those closer by who want just the renovation because it is perceived by some as less invasive to the neighborhood. Proximity largely drives that mindset.

4 months, 2 weeks ago ( Link to this comment | Suggest removal )

bobdon000

bobdon000 Anonymous

Don't blame the community (or individuals). WF really didn't want to spend the $112/SF required to do a new store on a site that they control for less than 21 years under a ground lease which is restrictive and they may ultimately get booted from. The corporate wigs decided it made more cents to spend $35/Sf in renovation and then re-assess the situation in several years.

Don't forget the corners of Mockinbird and Abrams will be in play in the next several years for a new grocery store and WF would probably love to do a bigger store format to serve Lakewood.

And the Abrams/Gaston site is really too small by today's grocery store standards which needs to be 60,000 SF for free-standing locations.

4 months, 2 weeks ago ( Link to this comment | Suggest removal )

Rawlins Gilliland Verified

PS: To my earlier point, sometimes the 'tribal rituals' are 'sufficating' no less at WF and Central Market..., although quite the polar opposite extreme.

4 months, 2 weeks ago ( Link to this comment | Suggest removal )

cehmann Anonymous

Pavel, the big deal on this (as Mike pointed out) is the high visibility of the location. The old Minyards was adequate but local residents were/are aching for something better. This area from Lakewood down to Hollywood/Santa Monica and from the M Streets east to the lake has gentrified to a higher income/disposable income area. The plans Whole Foods presented to the neighborhood groups looked fantastic (IMHO) but didn't adhere to the Planned District restrictions put in place in 1988 that required the building to be built along Abrams with a "storefront" "main street" feel. This upset some that wanted the PD enforced (or at least a nod to it). Many others just wanted the new pretty store. Much debate followed. That's my take on it.

4 months, 2 weeks ago ( Link to this comment | Suggest removal )

James Scott

James Scott Verified

I'm actually surprised they were even planning a tear-down-rebuild, considering the 80K flagship they're to build at the new Park Lane Place.

It's not like they're not going to have the ability to have just as much of the same stuff in the existing building than they would in the new building - yeah, maybe less esthetically pleasing, and some features found in fancier new places won't be there - but at the core will still be WF. Being equidistant to this Minyards and Park Lane Place, I'm still excited about the Minyard's location b/c it will be much easier to get in and out of and buy groceries at, which is the main reason I will go there.

4 months, 2 weeks ago ( Link to this comment | Suggest removal )

geopunk

geopunk Anonymous

What the hell is wrong with Kroger just up the street at Dr. Pepper Station? Sure the seafood may kill you, for that I go to Whole Foods, but come on.....we're not allowed to mention Kroger? I love it, just dont ever go on the weekend.

4 months, 2 weeks ago ( Link to this comment | Suggest removal )

Mike Orren

Mike Orren Staff

Arin, I'd mention and shop at Kroger, but I'm way further East...

4 months, 2 weeks ago ( Link to this comment | Suggest removal )

Scott Doyle

Scott Doyle Verified

Two things from Doyle:

  1. I absolutely love that booze is a primary factor in where Miko shops.

  2. While I empathize, I hope y'all realize that debating the quality of local grocers makes you sound very old.

That is all.

4 months, 2 weeks ago ( Link to this comment | Suggest removal )

cgrover Anonymous

I live in this particular East Dallas neighborhood being and, while we're on the subject of our grocery store deficiency, I thought I would share the reply I got after submitting a suggestion to the website of Sprouts Farmers Market (a newer, cheaper version of Whole Foods) http://www.sprouts.com/:

MY E-MAIL: We need you in EAST Dallas! I have just recently become aware of your fabulous store! I am excited to see that you have planned a store to be built in Richardson, TX, but I want to ask you to consider another store in the White Rock/East Dallas area. Why? People who choose to live in this area tend to be those who love an active and healthy lifestyle...that is why they gravitated to the lake in the first place. Additionally, a store in this area would be easily accessible to an extended clientele in the eastern suburbs of Garland and Mesquite via I-30 or I-80. We know of quite a few people who make a weekly 20-30 minute drive in from the suburbs to shop at the nearest Whole Foods. If you were here, I know they would be at your door. Just a suggestion!

THEIR REPLY: Thank you for your nice note! We certainly appreciate your invitation to the East Dallas area! We are looking at several locations throughout Southern California, Dallas Texas and Colorado. Although I'm not aware of a lease signed in White Rock … you never know when we may "sprout" in your neighborhood! I will certainly pass this information on to our Real Estate Department - as this is valuable feedback! Thank you so much for writing! Jeannie Rounds Customer Relations Sprouts Farmers Market 11811 N. Tatum Blvd. Suite 2400 Phoenix, AZ 85028 480-814-8016 ext. 330

4 months, 2 weeks ago ( Link to this comment | Suggest removal )

Peter Stawicki Verified

cgrover - while I shop at sprouts for speciality items, I just can't see taking them on as a full time, one stop grocery store. The choices are too limited and the brands while healthy can be might iffy and odd. (Ketchup is a big one for me. You ever try and get vegan ketchup out of the bottle???) But I guess it's another option.

4 months, 2 weeks ago ( Link to this comment | Suggest removal )

ericthegardener Anonymous

I sometimes shop at the Sprouts at Forest & Marsh even though I live in East Dallas. I love it. They'd be great in East Dallas or Oak Cliff.

4 months, 2 weeks ago ( Link to this comment | Suggest removal )

SocraticGadfly Anonymous

CGrover, hell, we need one south of the Trinity. Whole Foods or Central Market, whichever comes first. We've got plenty of people here, and other higher end stores now coming to Cedar Hill.

My purchasing? The bulk bin items like brown rice, whole wheat berries, etc? WF is cheaper and has a little more variety?

Spices? CM has much more variety.

Coffee? CM has more variety, including organics, fair trades, shade growns, and is cheaper.

Cheeses? WF is less expensive for sure; CM has slight edge on variety. Neither carries Vella's five-year old raw milk cheddar, even though CM, at least, carries other Vella cheeses.

Bread? Neither one is fantastic on store-brand pre-wrapped. As far as bakery, I lean CM.

4 months, 2 weeks ago ( Link to this comment | Suggest removal )

lakewooder

lakewooder Anonymous

Mike throws great parties, that's why he really can't patronize a dry grocery store.

I would suggest the Far West nightclub on Gaston at E. Grand for a full-service grocery store serving both sides of the lake. God knows a lot of people would like to be rid of that place - at least the East Dallas -- whoops White Rock YMCA - is not open when the drunk bumper cars and no law enforcement action starts late on weekends.

I don't think we were out of line wanting at least 'a nod' to the PD from WF. It took a couple of years and compromise from the Lakewood Shopping Center property owners and eight neighborhood groups to 'craft' the thing. WF should have known better than to be ham-fisted with East Dallas.

4 months, 2 weeks ago ( Link to this comment | Suggest removal )

Mike Orren

Mike Orren Staff

Sez Angela Hunt: Decision had next to nothing to do with zoning, everything to do with lower cost of renovation...

http://blogs.dallasobserver.com/unfai...

4 months, 1 week ago ( Link to this comment | Suggest removal )

Laura Seewoester

Laura Seewoester Staff

http://stuffwhitepeoplelike.wordpress...

4 months, 1 week ago ( Link to this comment | Suggest removal )

Teresa Gubbins

Teresa Gubbins Staff

Back Talk is speculating that the WF might bypass lakewood center and go into the albertsons at mockingbird & abrams instead

3 months, 3 weeks ago ( Link to this comment | Suggest removal )

Mike Orren

Mike Orren Staff

3 months, 3 weeks ago ( Link to this comment | Suggest removal )

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