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Thursday, January 31, 2008

Some Methodists rallying to stop proposed SMU Bush library

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Thanks to Somervell County Salon for pointing us to the New York Times article regarding controversy at Southern Methodist University over plans to build Bush's library on the campus. Opponents of the project think it should be put to a vote.

The Rev. Andrew Weaver, a research psychologist in New York who said an online petition drive against the project had drawn 11,200 signatures, said about 35 percent of the delegates were “progressives” opposed to the plan. “We need to inform and recruit 16 percent of the moderate delegates to block the project,” Mr. Weaver said.

More so than the library, that pesky Freedom Institute is causing some indigestion. What could be controversial about a policy institute dedicated to "compassionate conservatism?" Well, everything, really, but apparently there are some procedural issues as well.

The nature of the policy institute stirs much of the debate. In outlining the project to prospective universities in 2005, two officers of the foundation, Marvin P. Bush, a brother of the president, and Donald J. Evans, said the institute would be answerable to the foundation, not the university. [emphasis added.]

You didn't think the unitary executive theory would end because of term limits, did you? That would be an oxymoron.

The Rev. Weaver's insistence on a vote is admirable, but it's not clear that the library can be stopped at this point.

But officials at Southern Methodist, which is owned by the [South Central Jurisdiction], say they already have the church’s approval, through the jurisdiction’s Mission Council and College of Bishops, to lease land to the George W. Bush Foundation and are close to an agreement to do so.

You were expecting a democratic process? Did you not learn anything from this administration?

Personally, I think the idea of Bush and his cronies coming home to roost makes perfect sense. It started with a little seed of corruption that just kept expanding until it took over the state of Texas, then the U.S. and finally the world. And then, starting with the Libby trial, it began to contract in on itself until it has finally turned into a big, black hole in the heart of Dallas. Just call it the big bang theory of Texas politics.


Pegasus News content partner - North Texas Liberal

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Comments

Lisa Lawrence Merritt Verified

I signed the petition.

7 months, 1 week ago ( Link to this comment | Suggest removal )

Neff Conner Verified

The idea of this intellectually incurious President establishing a library is utterly laughable. And "Freedom Institute"? Another fine example of the Orwellian Bush-speak employed by those in Junior's inner circle. Remember these gems?: The "Clear Skies Act" that gutted the Clean Air Act; The "Healthy Forest Act" which allowed massive clear-cutting; "Compassionate Conservativism" - more like "conservatively compassionate" if you ask me.
Will someone please show me how w has increased freedom anywhere?? And before you say Iraq or Afghanistan, take a closer look. (What's left of) the citizens residing in those countries are not living in freedom right now.
i really hope the Methodists stand up to w and his enablers and tell him to take his un-Christian, war-mongering, constitution-killing, dictatorial ideologies elsewhere. Like Waco. Or better yet, Baghdad.

7 months, 1 week ago ( Link to this comment | Suggest removal )

Michael McCullough Verified

Texas Toad:

Personally, I think the idea of Bush and his cronies coming home to roost makes perfect sense. It started with a little seed of corruption that just kept expanding until it took over the state of Texas, then the U.S. and finally the world.

Yeah, and then Chimpy McBushHitler will corrupt the moon, then Mars, then the solar system, then the galaxy, and then the universe. Next, he'll use wormholes to corrupt alternate universes. And then Dick Cheney will be revealed as a Sith Lord and kill Luke Skywalker.

Toad, if you used a little less hyperbole, you might be taken more seriously by people other than Neff Conner.

What are the standards for being a "content partner" for Pegasus? Just a wild guess, but I'm thinking that they're not very high.

Maybe you should consider taking away the phrase "open-minded" from your blog header. Tell me, are you a "Truther" by any chance?

-Mike

7 months, 1 week ago ( Link to this comment | Suggest removal )

Michael McCullough Verified

Neff Conner:

Like Waco.

Wait, wasn't it just outside of Waco where Bill Clinton's government killed a bunch of people, including 21 children, ran over them with tanks, and used pyrotechnic tear gas? The FBI initially denied using the devices but later admitted it when the evidence to the contrary became overwhelming. See http://www.rickross.com/reference/wac... from the Dallas Morning News.

And what about the war in the former Yugoslavia? Congress never declared war and Clinton's actions were never authorized by the United Nations. What about those mass graves that were never found?

Oh, I forgot. Clinton cared. He was loving and compassionate.

-Mike

7 months, 1 week ago ( Link to this comment | Suggest removal )

OpusthePoet Anonymous

Mass graves that were never found? Dude what have you been smoking? They found so many mass graves that it became a "non-story". I remember reading about one that had over a thousand bodies in it, and it wasn't even the biggest.

Now about those WMDs, the only thing found was where they were dumped after Gulf I in response to the UN sanctions. And I seem to recall that most of those gas shells were labled in English, which means that Saddam had WMDs because we sold them to him...

The only thing I have against Clinton was his poor taste in mistresses. Hillary was hot, though. I guess he had to find something that was the "anti-Hillary" to turn him on...

Opus

7 months, 1 week ago ( Link to this comment | Suggest removal )

jtmbls Anonymous

Oh and then there is that pesky little episode in Somalia, where Clinton left behind our very own soldiers to be tortured and killed rather than make an unpopular decision...but back to the point...

Really, a Bush library is more than just a little funny...Don't you think W himself would rather us congregate in his name at a dance hall with a cold beer?

7 months, 1 week ago ( Link to this comment | Suggest removal )

Michael McCullough Verified

Opus,

Mass graves that were never found? Dude what have you been smoking? They found so many mass graves that it became a "non-story". I remember reading about one that had over a thousand bodies in it, and it wasn't even the biggest.

According to a 2007 UPI story, the largest mass grave found contained 600 bodies. (See http://100years.upi.com/sta_2003-10-0... )

The number of people reported kept on being revised downwards after the war. For example, a report from 2007 ( http://srebrenica-genocide.blogspot.c... ) says that "Bosnian Serb forces killed about 8,000 Bosniak men and boys in the Srebrenica genocide...." That's a far cry from what the Clinton administration was telling us.

Don't get me wrong. The slaughter in Bosnia was a terrible thing. My blog is heavy on human rights. Clinton was probably right to have intervened, though there were worse atrocities where he did not intervene. I'm just pointing out that the same people who claim that the war in Iraq is illegal conveniently ignore Clinton's war.

-Mike

7 months, 1 week ago ( Link to this comment | Suggest removal )

CastleHills Anonymous

Michael, I was willing to give you the benefit of the doubt...until I got to your website and read this:

"It makes her entire week when I take her to church....Taking Eva to church - even at times when she would rather watch TV - always blesses both of us."

Yikes. OK, it's going to be really difficult for you for the next 8 years with Hillary as YOUR Commander-In-Chief.

I know Texas Toad, and I take this person seriously. You guys on the far, far, far right are going to have to get used to being in the very small minority over the next decade.

7 months, 1 week ago ( Link to this comment | Suggest removal )

Michael McCullough Verified

CastleHills,

Michael, I was willing to give you the benefit of the doubt...until I got to your website and read this:

"It makes her entire week when I take her to church....Taking Eva to church - even at times when she would rather watch TV - always blesses both of us."

And what exactly is wrong with that? She encourages me to go church when I would rather sit in the recliner, too.

If Eva saw this, she would laugh at your implication that I boss her around and lord it over her. She's the one in the family with the strong personality. I'm bookish, quiet, and slightly introverted. When Eva walks in the room she is immediately the center of attention. Our personalities are a good match.

Did you find fault with the other things that I talked about, too? Like giving her flowers or a small gift for no special reason? Ooh, how evil.

Did you read the second sentence where I said that "leadership is not, of course, dominating the woman; it is the “follow me” kind of leadership?

It apparently is not familiar to you, but Christians who read the post will recognize that it expounds on the Apostle Paul's remarks that men should love thier wives as Christ loved the church. Jesus was a humble man who gave his life for the church. If the occasion ever arises, I am supposed to lay down my life for my wife. I hardly call that anti-female.

Read my post on Bearing Fruit (http://www.mcculloughsite.net/stingra... ). Here's a quote:

We have to be willing to lay down our lives for our friends — and our friends include a lot more than your best buddy, your children, or your spouse. Jesus laid down his life for us while we were still sinners. He commands us to do the same. Would you give your life to save your crabby next-door neighbor or your cruel and inept boss? Laying down my life for someone that I didn’t even like would be difficult.

Get that? I'm supposed to be willing to die for someone even if they don't like me. Hard stuff.

Does that explain things a bit more?

This is the first post that I've read from Texas Toad. He's just repeating the standard talking points of the left that you hear a thousand times a day. I'm not impressed though I do agree with him on Darfur.

You guys on the far, far, far right are going to have to get used to being in the very small minority over the next decade.

Far, far, far right? Actually I'm a center-conservative with a bit of a libertarian bent. And there a lot more of us than you think.

And when you see nuclear mushroom clouds over Tel Aviv, Paris, and maybe even American cities, you'll come running to us for help. Then you'll blame Bush for not recognizing Iran's threat.

-Mike

7 months, 1 week ago ( Link to this comment | Suggest removal )

CastleHills Anonymous

Michael,

I've lived in Texas long enough to know that when a "religious" man uses words like "lording it over" followed by "giving her flowers and small gifts," any women within earshot need to run for the hills.

And then you immediately prove my point by threatening mushroom clouds. Typical fear mongering by the far, far, far right. The only reason Americans need to fear a mushroom cloud is if we elect another ultraconservative to be President. Thankfully, that looks to be an impossibility now.

I won't even touch on the mention of Tel Aviv as your first choice for a mushrooom cloud...hopefully someday your religion won't require the extermination of the Jewish people in order to fulfill your hope of your messiah setting foot on earth again...

Now I'm coming perilously close to getting ejected from these comments by Pegasus. I won't let you force that on me. My wish is that you and your wife experience happiness in THIS life, as I do.

Shalom.

7 months, 1 week ago ( Link to this comment | Suggest removal )

Michael McCullough Verified

CastleHills,

I've lived in Texas long enough to know that when a "religious" man uses words like "lording it over" followed by "giving her flowers and small gifts," any women within earshot need to run for the hills.

I am not a religious man. I am a follower of Christ. Those are two very different things.

The words "lording it over" was a phrase that I said men should never do. The entire point of the article was to treat your wives well, love them, and nurture them.

By the way, that post came from an e-mail that my wife asked me to write. Some men in our friends and family don't treat their wives with the love and respect that they should. I sent the letter in response to something that she sent to a lot of people. It's an encouragement to husbands we know that they need to love their wives, listen to them, and pay attention to them.

If you met my wife and me, you would realize that domineering women is not my gig. My wife isn't even capable of being domineered.

I won't even touch on the mention of Tel Aviv as your first choice for a mushrooom cloud...hopefully someday your religion won't require the extermination of the Jewish people in order to fulfill your hope of your messiah setting foot on earth again...

I find the prospect of a mushroom cloud over Tel Aviv ghastly. However, it is likely the first choice of Ahmadenijad. Look at my blog -- I have a sidebar that gives daily news on Jewish Persecution and have often written about Jewish persecution. If you Google Jewish persecution blog, you'll find that my blog comes up first and second on the list. That's no accident -- I'm an ardent fighter of anti-semitism, as are almost all evangelical Christians.

If they ever come for the Jews in this country, they will have to step over the bodies of a lot of dead Christians, including me, to get to them.

I've been to an evangelical/semi-charimatic churches almost every week of my life. I have attended more Bible studies and classes than I can count. I have read hundreds of books by various Christian authors. Not once have I heard or read anything about Christians wanting Jews to die so that Jesus will come again. It's a total fabrication that's popped up in the press over the past few years. Anti-semitism and Christianity are totally incompatible. One cannot mistreat their fellow humans and be a follower of Christ.

Yeah, it's conceivable that there may be a Pastor Bucky Bob at First Podunk Baptist Church who teaches what you mentioned, but what you say is not only un-Biblical, but is just flat out wrong. Of course, the mainstream media never misses a chance to spread myths and bash Christians and observant Jews.

From your shalom comment, I see that it's possible that you might be Jewish. My mom served as a Shabbat Goy to the Jewish lady next door when we lived in an Orthodox neigborhood in San Antonio when I was a small boy.

I also had the pleasure of helping a very Orthodox family that I've known and loved since I was a teenager. Several years ago the father was hospitalized for months and ultimately passed on, which was a very sad experience for me.

When his family spent the Sabbath at the hospital, I served as their Shabbot Goy. When they stayed at home, I would go to the hospital and read him the Torah and Tanakh.

Now I'm coming perilously close to getting ejected from these comments by Pegasus. I won't let you force that on me. My wish is that you and your wife experience happiness in THIS life, as I do.

Hey, I'll stand up for you. You're a good, smart person. We may disagree on a few issues but I have a respect for you that I don't have for many posters.

Besides, I've already ticked off several reporters for pointing out inaccuracies in their writing. They aren't used to someone who actually confronts them with facts.

My wife and I do enjoy peace and joy in this life. I wish the same for you and your family.

Shalom,

-Mike

7 months, 1 week ago ( Link to this comment | Suggest removal )

Clay213 Anonymous

This post, and the comments following it, really blow.

7 months, 1 week ago ( Link to this comment | Suggest removal )

jtmbls Anonymous

Wow...At the first hint of Christianity, people just completely freak out - What is that about?

Castle - If his website had contained references to Hindu or the Muslim religion, would you have immediately attacked his belief system in that way?

Looks like we have a new Salem.

7 months, 1 week ago ( Link to this comment | Suggest removal )

Dr_Freud Anonymous

Well, you can't say I didn't warn you:

http://www.pegasusnews.com/news/2008/...

7 months, 1 week ago ( Link to this comment | Suggest removal )

Mike Orren Staff

@Michael:

"What are the standards for being a "content partner" for Pegasus? Just a wild guess, but I'm thinking that they're not very high."

If you're local and writing about local issues, and wish to be in, you're in, presuming you're not inciting crime, hate speech, etc. If you have suggestions for any conservative bloggers who meet that rubric, please let us know so that we can reach out to them. I checked out your blog, but it doesn't look like you do much local.

(Side note -- I hadn't been to Lileks' site in ages and your about page sent me last night. His recent updates to The Institute of Cheer kept the OrWell household entertained all evening.)

As to the level of the bar on the standards for inclusion-- Isn't that how the mainstream media (some say liberal media) keep out opposing views?

We're a big tent. We think we can get away with that and maintain relevance for each individual reader using a bit of nifty technology. One person's trash is another's treasure...

That said, we don't do anything to track lefty/righty in our customization system, largely because local generally isn't inherently partisan.

@All:

Here's what troubles me -- We've worked really hard to have an environment where open discourse is the norm and arguments almost always remain respectful when heated and don't disintegrate into ad hominem noise.

But -- and I'm not just talking about this conversation and those involved in it -- the rare cases where the conversation devolves (in either or both directions) are almost always related to partisan national politics that touch local issues. And judging by the upcoming national elections and the increasing heat on immigration issues, this stuff isn't going away.

Nor should it. But how do we keep these discussions even at the level of "smoking in bars" or "radio station playlists" or other things in the equine graveyard?

It's the ad-hominem that alternately bothers and bores me. If we could stay away from that, these discussions could be really interesting.

7 months, 1 week ago ( Link to this comment | Suggest removal )

jtmbls Anonymous

ad-hominem...Orren, you're my hero! Break out the Latin! (And I'm not just saying that because I've had a few!) :-)

7 months, 1 week ago ( Link to this comment | Suggest removal )

Lisa Lawrence Merritt Verified

Here's the problem: this is an internal issue of the Methodist Church,the Laity and an educational institution owned by the Church.

Given the idea of "separation of church and state" and given the fact that George Bush, Jr. associates himself with the United Methodist Church, many within the leadership and congregations of the UMC believe that the actions of the current Bush administration are in DIRECT conflict with the UMC philosophy, teachings and interpretation of the Christian faith.

I was brought up in the Methodist tradition and included myself with those who have signed the petition against allowing the Bush library and the "Freedom Institute" to be aligned with SMU and, therefore, the UMC as a whole.

Although the UMC is a church of "open hearts and open minds" and we welcome the opinions of all people, I would like to remind the Pegs Bloggers that this is an internal issue.

I would prefer that Bush and his supporters find a nice "state" supported university to make their offering to.(Just like Daddy)

In other words, I'd like to see the actions of Bush and His State separated from Our Church.

Have a nice day.

7 months, 1 week ago ( Link to this comment | Suggest removal )

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