Dallas’ Cedars neighborhood to stay home for industrial operations

alexander troup says:

The Stupid City, And not the Naked City,... when are they going to keep Industrial out of areas like that, that is what hit the area in the first place... back in 1909, oh well ..by by, Southdallas to the leaders of Posionville...A.T,.. ENDANGERED SEPCIES.

Michael Davis says:

I voted for this because this company is a good employer and had no environmental complaints. Plus its all enclosed. It wasn't fair to put them out of business. Urban areas have all types of uses, and as long as they aren't hurting the neighborhood they should be able to stay as long as they want.

alexander troup says:

Well Chris,... as behind the scene Observer, lets hope that will be the case, while I recall on Davis st in Oakcliff, they had some bad chrome and metal business, where you dip stuff,...sometime later on,kids born of these workers had missing hands and feet,I recall in the 80's when I lived in The Bishop Arts District, these areas are now gone..Until then.A.T,... Endangered Species.

Travis Bush says:

Agreed Mike. I could see a scenario where that area was seeing a housing boom and wanted to change the entire face of the neighborhood, but with the way our economy is, it doesn't see likely that will happen any time soon. I could see if the business was polluting the area, plenty of reasons to make them leave, but now it is likely to just run them out of business all together. Circumstances change and decisions by our city government should reflect that.

Jason Rice says:

Mike - no kidding. My first thought was "Heck, I want that guy representing me" - except I'd have to move.

alexander troup says:

I am just spreading a little fire and it is growing quite well...A.T,.. Campfire Scout of Southdallas.

alexander troup says:

Ross ave, like alot of Ross Avenue's all over Car Culture Amercia, has had its day back in the 1980's when Goss on Ross died and then the old Boarding House's that became Antique shop's became... DisD coffee and Egg Roll huts,so......one more roll down Ross and your on Greenville, another old Ross Avnue,.. so you have a point.. Geo skull, by they way you need some more make up, until then Goss was on Ross, A.T,... Historian of old mud lanes.

Travis Bush says:

Yes, it would be interesting to find out who benefits the most from removing businesses from their property. More condos and overpriced townhomes will be built and normal people will be shoved farther away from the city center. I haven't seen one effort made to build affordable apartments for people, especially around the Oak Lawn area. I dunno what kind of douches the City wants living in the city center, but apparently is won't be for people who make less than $100k a year. People tend to get offended when they get priced out of their own neighborhood, much less their own town.

Michael Davis says:

@ geo - I did not vote on that issue because I was out of the meeting because a meeting I had to cover with constituents. But I would have voted to give Woodward their permit. Angela is my friend, we just differed on that issue.

Chris Kidd says:

Another reason im considering packing my bags and moving back to Austin, at least there city government gives a damn about the citizens.

alexander troup says:

Austin is a cool place Chris, I had lived there, made love there and done a lot of school kid things, but it is a school town where the jobs are poor and again it is a fun place, but It has a no where feeling to it also...While Goverment work is there, you have to find the family that will allow you into that inner circle, and that could take years, nice thing about Dallas, and it ain't nice,... you can carve out your postion here and find your self saying, what is the meaning of life in this Pretentious Oasis...,Old Southdallas is another vision as Oak Cliff was or is or even Oak Lawn or Old East and West Dallas, While the Jewish Community realized the Cedars area and made that move in the 1940s, some thing's do and some thing's dont change, I love Austin but I can live there..Until then..A.T, Travler.

Robert Kelly says:

Laura- if it is that big of a deal to you, why not put together a consortium to purchase all these properties? Then you can do what you want with them. Quit relying on the govt to do what you want, if you think there is a market for more residential down there, do it yourself.

I don't think there is, and I would rather have an operating - tax paying entity there than another empty building.

BTW, who are these "Other developers who own property in the Cedars have been asked by their lenders to wait until the industry is out of the neighborhood before they seek the funding for development."

I'd like a little more info there.

alexander troup says:

Dallas,thinking of Dallas,..... land of Developer's and Developement...while in the Old South Dallas, the Cedar's was a natural place, that did sell some good house's back then.....the freeway really tore it in half and it is still in half value today or a house divided......A.T, Old Urban Developement.

alexander troup says:

I didnt want to move in there they did, and we learned that Idiot thing 20 years ago,...buried the dead and left, which is why I made the first comment, so let them find out....and you have a good point, besides.....this things has to boil over and then heal, and so let's find out who the sucker's are who did buy land there.......A.T, Urban Idiot.

Blake Ramick says:

Clay213

Only idiots make such open blanket comments.

This has more to do then people's pocket books. Whether Texas Nameplate stays or not my pocket book will be just fine. Here's the issues.

1. Texas Nameplate has grandfathered EPA exemptions. IE, they don't meet today's standards and that's a bad thing for everyone. As the city grows in density it's environmental risk to the city grows.

2. The community has clearly spoken that they want to see the area prosper, but Pauline chose to ignore that voice by ignoring plans already in place. The rezoning was done in 2002 and TX Nameplate fought and lost then. The new state of events are nothing more then the city blatantly not supporting what it has already put in place. And if the city was really concerned about the conservation of business then it wouldn't be getting ready to wipe out the area directly east of the trinity river and make room for new development.. which leads me to my next point.

3. The area is trying to build a community and the industrial is hindering that development. A community doesn't mean all residential. It means residents and business owners working together to make their area become the best that it can become. Improvement takes effort and time. For starters this includes a continued decrease in crime through support of the community and DPD, population growth and street improvements by the city. I have yet to see the involvement of TX Nameplate at any of the Cedars Neighborhood Association or Crime watch meetings. This is one HUGE reason why they differ from Lee Harvey's. Sure Seth is there to make money but he's also active in being a part of the community. It's (Lee Harvey's) become a central anchor to spear head improvement. And that's why residents support it so much. It's a catalyst for community.

4. Creative destruction is always a part of change. And it usually occurs because of an inefficiency. As downtown, Deep Ellum, Uptown and Oaklawn continue to develop the Cedars is a likely candidate for the most affordable housing of the group. There's a reason the area of industrial was zoned out. It's because it no longer belongs given the bright potential of the area.

5. And for those that new people moving in are kicking people out... Lack of zoning and the community not sicking together is what made the Cedars what it is today.. I-30 helped too. The Cedars used to have some of the finest homes in Dallas. For example, the first Jewish Synagogue in Dallas was there. Mr Marcus of Neiman's was raised there. And the industrial moved in (creative destruction), scraped the houses and built large factories. All for what, their own self serving interests? And where are they all now? Most of the fine homes and businesses are gone. And for several decades after the area continued to decline. So industrial has had their time to make the most out of the area. They failed along with most of the businesses.
   

In the last 10-15 years the area began improving. 15 years ago it was really rough. Gangs would hold people at gun point under the bridge at Ervay near American Beauty Mill and charge a toll to passing cars. The Cedars has come along way since then and is only continuing to improve.

Dallas is one of the most dynamically changing large cities in the US right now. We are in the midst of exciting times for Dallas. In another 10 years Dallas is going to see the competition of some huge projects. I'm proud to say I'm from Dallas.

The reality is though more jobs, arts, entertainment, homes, taxes, an overall increase quality life are being lost by the industrial staying. Texas Nameplate will leave. It's not a question of if, but when.

Blake Ramick says:

Michael Davis,

Thank you for your response on the issue. You have provided more insight into the matter then anyone else has at City Hall has so far. After numerous emails, phone calls and trying to schedule a meeting with Pauline Medrano it has left the Cedars residents feeling disconnected and ignored.

When it's all said and done Medrano will be able to put a feather in her hat for the JPI Cedars West development, The Trinity River Project and etc. That's how she'll be known.

It just doesn't make since why a community has to overwhelmingly fight tooth and nail to keep an active asset to the community like Lee Harvey's while trying to remove Texas Nameplate. It seems as though the city is fighting everything the area is asking support on. Medrano is leaving a bad taste in the mouth of a lot of people in the Cedars.

Maybe Monica is planning to run again for City Hall :)

Travis Bush says:

"As downtown, Deep Ellum, Uptown and Oaklawn continue to develop the Cedars is a likely candidate for the most affordable housing of the group."

I will believe that when I see it. Are you suggesting there are plans to construct something besides condos and town homes that most of us cannot afford to lease or purchase? The West Village is a good example of growth that has little if anything to do with "the people on the other side of the highway". You think any of those businesses or people who lease there have anything to do with Bryan Adams High School that resides right behind the West Village? You think they care about the people living in the projects over by Target? The answer is no and so shall it ever be.

alexander troup says:

Maybe, but I still won't move there, too much blood in the ground from year's and year's of real killing,s...ever vist a Battlefeild, only this was a 50 year old slum..until then.A.T, Let the dead sleep in Old Southdallas.

Blake Ramick says:

Travis,

I think it's safe to say most of the people that live in the Cedars don't want another West Village. And yes there are plans for other types of projects. One developer is looking into building sustainable green housing using untraditional methods of construction. Others have express interest in building a solar power community (as soon as Dallas, gets with the program to work on some tax incentives).

Travis I understand your concern for affordable housing, but given the proximity of the Cedars to downtown and it's estimated population growth land/rent is only going to get more costly. I do agree that there needs to be a variety of housing. Pricing is controlled by supply and demand though. As long as people are willing to pay the prices the developers will continue to build. (This is where the city council comes in.) Without a plan the city is giving developers a blank slate to build however they want. That's why creating a plan and sticking to it is so vitally important. It insures an area is developing in a way it's residents want it to instead of the way a developer with a big check book wants it to.

Accomplishing things in life are done by making a plan and going with it. There might be adjustments along the way, but they should be improvements to help reach whatever you ultimate goal is. They shouldn't be changes that deter that goal from happening.

"You think any of those businesses or people who lease there have anything to do with Bryan Adams High School that resides right behind the West Village" I don't personally know because I'm too active in that area of Dallas. I would figure it's partly because the West Village is a younger working crowd and don't have a lot of children. So it's probably not a priority to them.

alexander, Anyone who has been in Dallas a long time understands this. Oswald and his cohorts killed more then just JFK they killed downtown for about 20 years. Only in the last 5-7 years has it begun to recover. With that I ask you to keep in mind that you must remember what happened in the past and actively work to make sure it never happens again.

These are the types of things we're trying to do in the Cedars. We're trying to move it forward and make it more then a neglected and ignored area. You can't just write it off and throw it away, because you have scars along the way.

alexander troup says:

West Village came out of the concept of removal of old apartment's of an old Cole ave area which has become a sucess, connecting to Uptown area today, you cant copy this luck, hard work and good timming..

While it's history as a peaceful area has been a very good intown connector,while The Cedar's has the old farm town route's that date back to the days of cotton town movement as Southern route's would and date back to the 1900's as the working and trade route's that would affect not only Fair Park but the whole Southern sector,.. that was later cut up by the freeway system in the 1960's..., Bennett Miller made a great contrabution to the area 20 year's ago in opening Up the Flour Mill loft's, while the areas Industry dates back to the 1900's along with Railroad and freight...,Deep Elm had the same concept as a freight Community also, while that would change by the 1940s, and this Railroad history is now gone in terms of use, while the Dart line does well passing by the Cedar's...Today, Adding a work force Industry today, but what kind of reality is this present work force.

Blake..your right about J.F.K, and it's affect on Dallas..back to the Cedar's, I have watched that area because it held 25 landmark building's, now down to about 6, and yet I still feel and see it's potential as a [big gamble] to sit on land and wait for that Dallas developement vison to grow and happend at this point in time,... while Urban Pioneers like photographer George Goodnow would invest in the area 20 years ago and come out a looser, many people have.. while I should say, I too was a Pioneer in the area as many artist have been over the past 25 years, while the assement of what the area was and could be...Again..... an important subject to realize at this point in time,.. due to the present economey in massive upheavel and transition that we are now in.. and the number of year's left to create this Southdallas vision, but from who's perspective...Again Travis has again lit a fire on what are we to contemplate as well as Chris and the other Peg Observer's, until then,... Alexander Troup, South Dallas Pioneer, from the 1970,s.

Blake Ramick says:

"I will believe that when I see it. Are you suggesting there are plans to construct something besides condos and town homes that most of us cannot afford to lease or purchase?"

Larry Hamilton is about to submit for state funding to build low income housing at the Ramada Inn location right next to the Buzz. The details are not yet ironed out. But to answer your question.

So YES, plans for something besides town homes and condos are in the works. Even he gets funding the City will still have to approve the development. Though I don't that will be a problem if it get's that far.

Like anything too much of anything is bad and that includes condos, low income housing, vacant lots, clubs, liquor stores (referring to Mr Davis's post about South Dallas) and etc.

alexander troup says:

I Had at one time seen that area as a kid and it was really a unique Historical area, very Southern...and yet, sad it became what you see today...A/T...Time marches on..