Content from our friends over at Dallas Progress
Monday, September 28, 2009
Dallas renters pay just as much in taxes as homeowners
DALLAS — In the weeks and month leading up to the city council's adoption of a new budget, I have seen several blogs and forums that have taken the attitude that renters do not pay taxes and that somehow don't matter in this city.
I saw one post in particular after the council voted this week, which stated that "property owners in the city, subsidize the majority of the population who are renters." I guess the same goes for commercial tenants. Sometimes I wonder about the lucidity of these individuals. So you mean to tell me that none of the rent that is paid by an apartment dweller or office user ends up in the city coffers? Seriously?
Acting like renters don't pay tax is an arrogant, failed argument. A check may not be written directly to the municipality by a renter, but don't act like property taxes don't get paid in some fashion. Anybody that knows anything about real estate knows that any increase in property taxes will get passed along to tenants in the form of a rent increase. It's as ridiculous as the people picketing with "I hate government signs" but use our police, electric, and water utilities. I mean, if you hate government then you at least have a rainwater collection system and solar panels on your house, right? I digress.
In fact, if you do the math on how much tax some of the "renters don't matter" crowd pays, I would bet that our unimportant (to them) household of renters ends up paying more in taxes then that amount and has for years.
I guess if there weren't people to rent apartments and commercial space, the property owners would happily keep paying the same level taxes to the city and county. I guess you would still have a downtown Dallas, since developers build buildings just so they can pay taxes out of their own pockets instead of having renters whose rent will allow for such payments. Or maybe not. Maybe, just maybe, the lease payments (rent) of said property end up in the hand of the building owner who then (gasp) pays some of it to the city and county in the form of property tax.
The reasoning of some that it's OK to raise taxes because Dallas voters approved a bond program also doesn't hold water. Voters approved that increase in taxes for bond-program related projects, not to fund city services and programs.
Homeowners and renters make a city. Picture where your city budget would be without renters, then maybe you'll reconsider your attitude about our contribution.
Pegasus News content partner - Dallas Progress
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Assuming renters don't pay property taxes is about as dumb as the argument that illegal immigrants don't pay taxes at all. It isn't based on logic. Just feelings of fear and superiority.
John McClelland Verified
1 month, 3 weeks ago
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I literally can't believe this even has to be an article.
Pavel Lishin Verified
1 month, 3 weeks ago
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Renters subsidize city services they can't participate in, like curbside recycling.
OEsophagus Anonymous
1 month, 3 weeks ago
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Same, Pavel. Anybody who doesn't understand that a landlord passes on the cost of property taxes shouldn't be involved in any argument ever made, ever.
OEsophagus, I presume you're whining about apartment renters "subsidizing" city services (btw, the term generally implies government aiding private sector - not the other way around)? Property owners pay tax. They pass this cost along to people occupying the space. Don't like it? Buy instead of rent.
Guess I need to stop reading the news, because I want to slap people in the street every time I see something like this.
Scott Doyle Verified
1 month, 3 weeks ago
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(This comment was removed by the site staff.)
OEsophagus Anonymous
1 month, 3 weeks ago
I didn't realize OEsophagus was whining, I thought he was cheering us all on.
Also, when we're done needlessly discussing this, we should also bring up the point of whether it's fair for me to pay taxes that go to subsidize schools when I don't have any chilluns attending, and own a stick big enough to keep the kids off my lawn without requiring a daily 8-3 prison.
Pavel Lishin Verified
1 month, 3 weeks ago
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Pavel, a well educated population is to everyone's benefit. I struggled with the issue as well, paying school taxes while at the same time paying private school tuition. But what I realize is that we can pay to educate these kids now, or pay to maintain them or welfare on in jail later.
The more prosperous your neighbor's kids become in their adulthood, the more tax (including social security) they will pay. So they will be, in effect, supporting you in your dotage.
momzilla Anonymous
1 month, 3 weeks ago
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OEsophagus, point made, but it was a little inappropriate for our site.
Sarah Blaskovich Staff
1 month, 3 weeks ago
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Glad to see this one got some comments. I couldn't believe people thought this way either.
Michael Davis Verified
1 month, 3 weeks ago
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momzilla: I agree with you entirely, I was being sarcastic. I should have made that more clear.
Pavel Lishin Verified
1 month, 3 weeks ago
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Momzilla there's an easy telltale way to spot if Pavel is being sarcastic:
He's breathing.
Jason Rice Verified
1 month, 3 weeks ago
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I AM cheering you on. And you should be HAPPY that renters are paying for your recycling. And renters should benefit from city services that they pay for.
OEsophagus Anonymous
1 month, 3 weeks ago
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And I still invite Scott Doyle to put his face in my pants.
OEsophagus Anonymous
1 month, 3 weeks ago
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Some pants are just more enticing than others, EO.
Jason Rice Verified
1 month, 3 weeks ago
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Jason - Where did you find my jeans? I just assumed my maintenance man had stolen them.
Good luck OEsophagus. I have extended that very same invitation to Doyle on at least 50 different comment threads. Nada!
jtmbls Anonymous
1 month, 3 weeks ago
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<i>And I still invite Scott Doyle to put his face in my pants. </i>
Folks these days are so rude. Hell, at least buy him a Margarita down at the Pearl first. They're the finest, strongest, cheapest drinks in town on Wednesday.
Pavel Lishin Verified
1 month, 3 weeks ago
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YEA,.... THAT IS A REAL PAIR OF HOT PANTS.....
alexander troup Verified
1 month, 3 weeks ago
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Yarr, the hot pants!
<img src="http://img44.imageshack.us/img44/8200/seacaptain.jpg">
Pavel, quite right. Gotta get me lit while supporting the Yosts before I'll even consider rendering those types of services. Savvy, jtm?
Doctor's note signed same day indicating no STDs vastly increases your chances, btw.
Scott Doyle Verified
1 month, 3 weeks ago
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"Doctor's note signed same day indicating no STDs vastly increases your chances, btw."
ScoDo couldn't stand it if you ended up in the same support group.
Travis Bush Verified
1 month, 3 weeks ago
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One man's support group is another man's singles bar.
Pavel Lishin Verified
1 month, 3 weeks ago
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Uh, yeah...I just so happen to have <del>a stack of</del> one of those notes right here!
Oh for fs sake! What kinda code are you people running around here?
Uh, yeah...I just so happen to have <strike>a stack of</strike> one of those notes right here.
Gaaah!
jtmbls Anonymous
1 month, 3 weeks ago
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Don't know what you're doing, Tumbles -- it <del>works for me</del>. (del /del should be fine.)
Alex Bentley Staff
1 month, 3 weeks ago
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Tumbles <strike>can't</strike> <em><font size="8">type</font></em>
<table border="1"> <tbody><tr><td>n'yah</td><td>n'yah</td><td>n'yah</td><td>n'yah</td></tr>
</tbody></table>
Jason Rice Verified
1 month, 3 weeks ago
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Yes, but who do you think absorbs the risk of the tax expense outstripping the rental market's ability to reimburse it. The OWNER/LANDLORD. So no, renters don't pay taxes, they pay rent. The landlord then pays the taxes out of the rent he collects (or tries to collect in some cases). Regardless of whether the rent pays his rent the landlord pays the taxes.
Aaron Johnson Verified
1 month, 3 weeks ago
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::Regardless of whether the rent pays his rent the landlord pays the taxes.
Or in breakfast terms. Bacon and Eggs: The chicken is involved, but the Pig is committed. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Chic...
Jason Rice Verified
1 month, 3 weeks ago
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What the H??? Showoffs!
Nice analogy by the way.
jtmbls Anonymous
1 month, 3 weeks ago
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<font color="#FFFFFF" size="5"><table><tbody><tr><td bgcolor="#FF0000" color="#FFFFFF">Nee-ner!</td><td></td><td bgcolor="#0000FF" color="#FFFF00">Nee-ner!</td></tr><tr><td></td><td bgcolor="#00FF00" color="#FFFFFF">Nee-ner!</td><td></td></tr></tbody></table></font>
Jason Rice Verified
1 month, 3 weeks ago
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jtm, think it's just letter s, not the whole word <s>strike</s>.
Bring one of your notes to Pearl next Wed and we'll talk bidness.
Scott Doyle Verified
1 month, 3 weeks ago
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No, tried that first. <s>see</s> :( It just doesn't like me.
Alright, but only if Jason will give me my fancy jeans back. (Can't trust anyone these days!)
jtmbls Anonymous
1 month, 3 weeks ago
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lol, @ at the noob
Jesus Valadez Verified
1 month, 3 weeks ago
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Well --- lemme see <table><tbody><tr> <td>'Puter on?</td><td> ✓ </td></tr> <tr><td>Browser up?</td><td> ✓ </td></tr> <tr><td>Keyboard plugged int?</td><td> ✓ </td></tr> <tr><td>Training Wheels off?</td><td> ✓ </td></tr></tbody></table>
<s>strike with s</s>
<strike>strike with strike</strike>
<del>strike with del</del>
<style type="text/css"> .dastrike {text-decoration: line-through;} </style> <div class="dastrike">strike with snazzy css style def</div>
Something tells me Tumbles' taskmasters have her working on IE4.
Ah the allure of Firefox....
Or MAYBE!!! --- Tumbles has found a way to get ScoDo's attention focused on her pants with a "Damsel in (Formatting) Distress" ruse.
Jason Rice Verified
1 month, 3 weeks ago
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<s>I wonder if Safari likes it</s>
momzilla Anonymous
1 month, 3 weeks ago
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You mean that's it?? It's this freaking browser that makes me miserable in every technologically possible way?? I wouldn't doubt it for one second...I never knew geeks could be so cruel.
Just so you know, life is hard enough without Jesus laughing at you!
jtmbls Anonymous
1 month, 3 weeks ago
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I'm loling with you, jtm, with you...
Jesus Valadez Verified
1 month, 3 weeks ago
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I never knew geeks could be so cruel.
Apparently you haven't paid attention to most of Pavel's posts since you joined.
And props to J-Rizzle once again. Must say I look damn good in relatively shining armor.
Scott Doyle Verified
1 month, 3 weeks ago
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jtmbles: Old trick. If you want to see what they're really doing, cut and paste the text into notepad so that it shows up unformatted.
momzilla Anonymous
1 month, 3 weeks ago
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<i>Apparently you haven't paid attention to most of Pavel's posts since you joined. </i>
YOU ALSO HAVE BAD SKIN, PROBABLY
Pavel Lishin Verified
1 month, 3 weeks ago
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this whole series of comments is so damned impressive.
bowing to you all, so smart so creative
Teresa Gubbins Staff
1 month, 3 weeks ago
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Oh wow - Great idea mom! It didn't occur to me put it in reverse.
Teresa – Admit it - You just want to borrow my sassy jeans!
jtmbls Anonymous
1 month, 3 weeks ago
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Tumbles. Just get an updated browser AND a current java install - sounds like your text edit slaps escape codes/ascii equivs in as you type. so you type
<s>
and you see
<s>
but what got stuck in behind your back is
&lt;;s&gt;;
(which I had to escape like bloody freak'n' crazy just to show up)
Jason Rice Verified
1 month, 3 weeks ago
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I have Firefox at home, just not work. I guess they expect me to work at work. So lame!
Thanks for the super support all! Except Pavel, who contributed very little.
jtmbls Anonymous
1 month, 3 weeks ago
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::I guess they expect me to work at work
Those rat b*st*rds!
Don't they realize it's a Democratic Congress?
Jason Rice Verified
1 month, 3 weeks ago
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<i>Except Pavel, who contributed very little. </i>
I prefer to stay predictable.
Pavel Lishin Verified
1 month, 3 weeks ago
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