Posted on April 30, 2008 at 2:11 p.m.

Well... that all seems pretty clear.

My apologies for entering the "secret club." I had an initial interest because I was in Dallas for the premiere screening of Expelled. I was invited by a friend involved with the local event. That's where I first saw John and his female partner sitting in on the press conference. I leaned over to my friend that day and said: "I can tell from that guys attitude walking in that he's already decided how he will review this film." And I was correct. Not uncommon. Most of us have preconceived notions about things that skew our perspectives. But none the less, it's clear I have more than worn out my welcome here... Clearly this thread only welcomes one perspective. Somewhat clarifying the point of the Expelled movie.

Thanks to Joshua for welcoming another perspective, to Andrew for helping me adjust my temperament and to Rick who while we differ completely in our views, didn't make me feel like an "annoying, obnoxious, troll."

God bless you Dallas! Ciao.

On Movie review: Expelled: No Intelligence Allowed

Posted on April 30, 2008 at 10:52 a.m.

xdavidwattsx... I'm not sure what your problem is but the numbers of posts on this blog are miniscule in comparison to thousands of blogs currently debating this very same subject on the net. Check out the Expelled web site blog catalogue where many of the topics went into the thousands of posts... Are we keeping you from a pressing engagement or something? Are you being forced to read what the "trolls" are saying?

On Movie review: Expelled: No Intelligence Allowed

Posted on April 30, 2008 at 10:49 a.m.

Excellent points Josua... And the quotes strongly support your perspective so no one can accuse you of not having a source.

C.S. Lewis is a favorite author of mine. I'd love to see the likes of Dawkins debate with Mr. Lewis. Wouldn't that have been entertaining?

On Movie review: Expelled: No Intelligence Allowed

Posted on April 30, 2008 at 4:09 a.m.

kps... It doesn't sound like you're seeing the film will alter your opinion on the subject matter much. You sound pretty sure of what to expect already... Simply by hearsay. I'm betting there's little chance you'll allow anything to persuade your hard core stand on the issue...

I have a few questions for you though. How does injecting an atheistic world view into the science classroom, make you feel better about our future doctors, nurses and others who will "effect your well-being." Why don't you consider teaching evolution with an Atheistic agenda "watered down?" By their own admission, 3 of the leading professors in the Film credit their Darwinian Evolution education for their "religious de-conversions." How does that fall under the category of science? What does that have to do with anything even remotely involving the sciences? Why are you and others so threatened by the concept of ID that is only an alternate "theory" regarding life's origin, but you don't seem the least bit concerned with professors of our universities who describe in detail their visions for a religion-free society and promote their non-scientific views quite publicly? Not only do they publicly admit their agenda, they ruthlessly set out to destroy religion by tainting the minds of our youth via their blog sites, books, interviews and youTube videos... Positioning Atheism as cool and modern, contrasted by their view of religion or ID as a joke and outdated, uneducated nonsense. These people are using any means possible to spread their Atheistic propaganda under the "guise" of SCIENCE. Ruthlessly attacking anyone who dares to stand up to them. Labeling all who disagree with them as "insane, stupid or ignorant." You call that science? You think that's "smart?"

On Movie review: Expelled: No Intelligence Allowed

Posted on April 29, 2008 at 5:20 p.m.

Susan, Joshua's description is accurate without a doubt. I think the film has more than one message though. Freedom of speech definitely is raised when members of the scientific community are outwardly ridiculed or "punished" if they question or challenge the status quo. There's even a journalist in the movie who describes the hate mail she and her paper received when she just wrote an article about a scientist speculating on ID. That's an attack of her free speech rights, wouldn't you say? The list goes on extensively in the movie but you get my point.

The point I was referring to mostly and the one I think should be alarming to us all is the obvious influence the Atheistic "world view plays" in shaping science today. This should be every bit as alarming to you as if the Pope were influencing science. Neither one belong in science but it would be extremely naive to suggest Atheism is not an influence.

In the movie you hear Atheist PZ Myers speak of that utopian world without religion. You hear Atheist Richard Dawkins read from his book "The God Dilusion," a collection of the most demonstrable words in the English language, describing in his personal perspective the Judeo Christian God. You see Atheist Jeanie Scott with her map of the country covered with pins indicating the thousands of places in the country were her organization is fighting legal battles to stomp out any and all attempts by anyone, who dares to challenge or question the complete authenticity of Darwinian evolution. Her organization is DEDICATED to stopping out the discussions before they get a chance to begin. You hear Atheist Dr. Will Provine, step clearly outside the box of science to describe life as meaningless, purposeless, godless and with no foundation for ethics... Dawkins, Myers and Provine all 3 share their de-conversion stories from Christianity to Atheism and all 3 give credit to Darwinism for their lost faith. This very same world view is being force fed to our children in the public schools, where science is clearly selling more than scientific ideas... it is selling a particular world view. That is dangerous, that is not science and this needs to be made public and stopped.

WHY, would you want to encourage this any further... unless you are sympathetic to that same Atheistic world view. In which case you're no longer talking about science and you need to be EXPELLED as well.

On Movie review: Expelled: No Intelligence Allowed

Posted on April 29, 2008 at 11:51 a.m.

Joshua,

I'm glad to hear you're intrigued to see the film. You may want to go see it soon though... the press and lawsuits have destroyed the movies opportunity to be unbiasedly represented, which has strongly impacted ticket sales and it may not be in theaters much longer. It's a crime too because the message is very real, very important and effects us all.

On Movie review: Expelled: No Intelligence Allowed

Posted on April 29, 2008 at 10:20 a.m.

Billusa99... Been there, done that. Gave up shrooms and pot around the same time my acne cleared up. But thanks for the advice.

On Movie review: Expelled: No Intelligence Allowed

Posted on April 29, 2008 at 10:18 a.m.

Joshua,

No doubt Michael Heller is a "stand alone" kind of guy... Priest, cosmologist and philosopher. Few if any of the "big names" of science who get the media's attention the most, could hold a candle to Mr. Heller. (R. Dawkins, PZ Myers, etc.) Unless I'm mistaken though, Michael did not win the "Nobel Peace Prize," but rather he won the Templeton Prize of 1.6 million dollars in March of 2008.

The "John Templeton Foundation" is a privately owned organization that awards grants to encourage scientific discovery on the "big questions" in science and philosophy. That's how the NYT describes the foundation. The Templeton foundation also presented the makers of the Passion of the Christ with a $50,000 award for "Most Inspirational Movie." The Templeton foundation has also been strongly criticized by much of the scientific community as an extension of other right-wing causes, for it's linking of scientific and religious questions.

The John Templeton foundation has in the past been a supporter of ID proponents. In 1999 it provided a grant to the Discovery Institute... the organization strongly criticized by many of the anti-ID scientists in the Expelled Film. Alas, the pressures of Big Science have influenced the Templeton foundation as well and the foundation released a statement in 2007 denouncing their support for ID. None the less the Foundation's views on the connections between religion and science has lead to great debate within the scientific community.

So all that to say... I don't really see how Michael Heller's Templeton Prize does anything to undermine the premise of Expelled. If anything it shines more light on the mystery into why more people like Mr. Heller aren't encouraged rather than criticized and ostracized.

On Movie review: Expelled: No Intelligence Allowed

Posted on April 28, 2008 at 10:14 p.m.

Ok, so let me see if I'm following you all... You guys will contemplate stories such as mushrooms being remnants of antiquarian matter from aliens, that may have lead to the first belief in God but a scientist who looks at the code in a DNA strand and determines the mathematical equation necessary to create the first living molecule by chance is astronomically impossible and is therefore lead to theorize intelligent involvement, is ludicrous and non-scientific? And Richard Dawkins can admit he sees the signature of intelligence in nature but if he were to want to examine that further that would no longer be science... That would be philosophy and he'd have to leave the science room and go down the hall to the philosophy classroom and set up his equipment again to proceed with his studies legitimately. Am I following you correctly so far?

On Movie review: Expelled: No Intelligence Allowed

Posted on April 27, 2008 at 6:19 p.m.

Billusa99: You misrepresent my words on every single point. Typical. I never implied Richard Dawkins lent credence to the movie other than when in the uncut interview with Ben Stein towards the end of the film, Richard clearly admits it's quite possible to see what he referred to as "the signature of intelligence in nature." That's quite a different thing from saying he lent credence to the movie. While twisting my words to refer back to Richard's' rant about how he was "tricked" into being in a "creationist movie" all one has to do is look at the well publicized letter that Mr. Dawkins first received, inviting him to take part in the movie. In that introductory letter, here is exactly the way the movie was described by the producers:

"We are interested in asking you a number of questions about the disconnect/controversy that exists in America between Evolution, Creationism and the Intelligent Design movement."

If you can prove this description misrepresents the core of Expelled, THEN you have a legitimate argument... HOWEVER... you cannot make such a claim so you should be ashamed for spreading lies and rumors. That description is EXACTLY what the movie is about and Mr. Dawkins makes a living at giving his opinion on this subject. He has no honest argument and neither do you.

As for the name of the movie... Are you kidding me? Dawkins was first approached nearly 2 years before the film was released. SO WHAT if the name was changed later... do you have ANY idea how often movie titles change in this industry? Dawkins also signed a contract with the producers and in that contract it was clearly stated that the film name might change. You have no case here... No smoking gun or evidence of wrong doing. Just a smoke screen attempt to distract people from hearing the truth about the unscrupulous actions of an atheistic elite group who are distorting and highjacking science... and how they use "tools" like your self to do most of their propaganda spreading for them.

Regarding my mentioning of the tribes... You completely misrepresented why I mentioned them to begin with. If you had read more carefully before you falsely twisted my words, you'd have seen that I was referring back to the statements by previous posters claiming that ID and Expelled are Christian propaganda. I was pointing out that Ben Stein is Jewish and that the majority of religions in the word believe in a creator and that even uninfluenced tribes believe in a "god" so clearly it would be impossible to label all who believe in an intelligent creator as Christians.

Lastly with regard to your predictions of the movie... time will tell. I'm no psychic but apparently you think you are. I would not lay odds on your predictions though. It may take a while for this to spread as the Producers of Expelled are no financial match for the Hollywood marketing budgets but over time I would not be surprised to see this movie become a film of significant importance... maybe in the theaters or maybe later in the DVD release. This wouldn't be the first time a film gained it's greatest success after leaving the theaters. We'll see.

On Movie review: Expelled: No Intelligence Allowed